Used 'R8' Spyder Market in the US around Jan 11th, 2013! (caution - long read)

[z356]

I joined R8Talk in May 2010 when I first started seriously considering purchasing an R8. With the help of Desperado & members of the San Francisco Region of the Audi Club whom I met at an ALMS race at Laguna Seca, I was able to attend the 'Audi Driving Experience' at Sears Point (Infineon) in Sonoma and drive R8's all day long! I started doing my R8 research by reading EVERY thread ever posted on R8Talk! Eventually I decided that I did not have a good grasp of the R8 market and put my purchase on hold. Two of the threads that I personally started back then have become part of the sticky 'FAQ: Audi R8 Introduction and Road Map to R8Talk.com' on this forum. Although the data points are out of date, they give you a snapshot of what I was trying to analyze & wrestle with in my mind re: the US R8 market back in 2010!

Why I may still buy an R8...(long)

Discounts on R8

Fast forward to early January, 2013. I have just purchased a MY2011 R8 v8 Spyder. Used, with 3800 miles. In service date of Sept. 29th, 2011. Balance of warranty until Sept. 28th, 2015. Minimal options - Lava Gray, Nav with AMI & Illuminated Door Sills. Total MSRP $135,675. I will post more photos of this particular vehicle when InterCity delivers it to me early in February. Right now it's still at the dealer on the East Coast!

Shortly after I closed my deal on Jan. 7th, I recorded most of the comparable R8's Spyders v8 that were for sale at Cars.com and Autotrader.com in the US. This is not the totality of the market (e.g. eBay listings were not included), but it gives you an idea of what was being asked for in used Spyders as of early January of this year! I selected only MY2011 & MY2012 R8 Spyders since that was the target of my acquisition!

Source Cars.com & Autotrader.com / The 13 least expensive 'used' MY 2011 & MY2012 r8 V8 Spyders for Sale in US on Jan. 11, 2013.

WUASUAFG2BN002266 - Nashua - $109K - Daytona - 18K miles- 6 sp - #1
WUAUUAFG8BN001759 - Momentum - $110K - Silver? -11K miles - R-tronic - #2 (sold)
WUAUUAFG0BN002324 - MB of Annapolis - $119k - Lava - 4K miles - 6 sp - #3 (sold)
WUASUAFGXBN002435 - MB of Pembroke- $123K - Black - 9K miles - R-tronic - #4
WUASUAFG0BN002279 - Sonnen - Black - $126K - R-tronic - 10K miles #5
WUASUAFG8BN002739 - Texas Import - $127K - Black - 3K miles - R-tronic - #6
WUASUAFG4BN002835 - Twin Cities Lux - $130K - Black - 6K miles- R-tronic- #7
WUASUAFG3BN002650 - Gaudin - Black - $130K - 6K miles - R-tronic - #8
WUASUAFG3BN002583 - Texas Direct - Black - $130K - 4K miles - R-tronic - #9
WUAUUAFG0CN002485 - Desert European - Daytona - $133K - 1.4K miles - MY '12 - 6sp #10
WUAUUAFG8BN001471 - Domani Motors - Ibis - $133K - 3K miles - 6sp - #11
WUASUAFG6CN000926 - Century - Black - $140K - 1.4K miles - MY '12 - R-tronic - #12
WUAUUAFG3BN002611 - Silverline - Jet Blue - $140K - 8K miles - 6sp- #13

That same day these were also the lowest priced MY2011 v10 Spyders for sale in Cars & Autotrader:

WUAVNAFGXBN000291 - Private sale - Black - $128K - 20K miles - R-Tronic - v10 #1
WUAVNAFG0BN002048 - AutoMall - Red - $130K - 21K miles - R-tronic - v10 #2
WUAVNAFG4BN002327 - Private sale - Ibis - $135K - 11K miles - R-tronic - v10 #3
WUATNAFG2BN002219 - Carbiz - Black - $138K - 11K miles - 6sp - v10 #4
WUAVNAFG8BN002377 - Santa Monica - Red- $138K - 17K - R-tronic - v10 #5
WUATNAFG2BN000177 - Valenti - Brown - $139K - 11K miles - 6sp - v10 #6
WUATNAFG1BN001367 - Georgia - Daytona - $140K - 12K - 6sp - v10 #7
WUAVNAFG5BN001266 - Interstate - Silver - $140K -10K miles - R-tronic - v10 #8
WUAVNAFG4BN000979 - Fischer - Teak - $145K - 1K miles - R-tronic - v10 #9

The least expensive left-over, new & unsold MY2012 v8 Spyders were these five:

WUAUUAFG3CN002920 - Momentum - Silver - $147K - new - MY'12 (sold)

WUAUUAFG2CN003055 - Princeton - Suzuka - $149K - new - MY'12 (sold)

2012 Audi R8 4.2 MSRP $149,175, 6-Speed Manual,
Dealer: Audi North Shore (Milwaukee, WI)

2012 Audi R8 4.2 MSRP $149,175, Ibis White, 6-Speed Manual,
Dealer: Byers Imports (Columbus, OH)

2012 Audi R8 4.2 MSRP $149,175, 6-Speed Manual,
Dealer: Cherry Hill Imports (Cherry Hill, NJ)

The least expensive left-over, new & unsold MY2012 v10 Spyder was this one and it went up in price from there!

2012 Audi R8 5.2 MSRP $172,000, Daytona Gray, 6-Speed Manual, WUATNAFG6CN002760
Dealer: Blue Grass Audi (Louisville, KY)

The data above tells the story. Mileage is a larger factor than most would have expected. Some v10's are getting pretty darn attractive in price, if you don't mind some mileage! It is all there for you to analyze and form your own conclusions as to what those asking prices were telling us that day!

************************************************** ***

These statistics formed the matrix which I used to decide what & how I should negotiate my purchase. I had one large handicap which limited my range of options - I needed to trade-in my 36K mile MY2007 Mercedes CL600! Although the most wonderful touring car I have ever owned (a v12 bi-turbo with over 630 ft. pound of torque & 4 levels of seat massage!), there is a very limited demand for these v12 vehicles in the second-hand market! I had been actively tracking R8 sales since I sold my '12 Porsche Boxster Spyder last summer. On Dec. 28th, I looked at my daily 'alerts' from Autotrader.com and found a MY2011 R8 v8 Spyder listed that had been recently traded-in to the same MB dealer where I had purchased new my CL600 five years earlier! The MB dealer is located in Annapolis, MD and I am in the West Coast - so everything was done via email & phone. I contacted them that day but didn't received a reply until January 2nd. Apparently the R8 had already a deposit, so they were slow in responding! But that deal fell apart later that week and we started seriously negotiating a trade & cash deal on Jan 4th, which was finalized on Jan 7th! The car I purchased is #3 on the used v8 Spyder list above. I benefited from a generous trade-in allowance for my CL600 which would NOT have been matched by any Audi dealer! On the other hand, these folks were not that familiar with R8's and marketing this car was really outside their 'comfort' zone! For example, their ad listed the vehicle as having a B & O sound system, which was not true. So it worked for both of us. They got a CL600 they are fully conversant & got rid of an Audi they didn't know what to do with! It's also winter (not Spyder weather in most of US) & January is a traditional slow sales month! Bottom line - I got a good deal on the R8! I have calculated that my actual acquisition cost for the R8 Spyder is around $110K. The paperwork says $114K. The asking was $119K!

The market has changed significantly since when I was considering an R8 purchase back in 2010. The 3,800 mile MY2011 R8 v8 Spyder I bought for $110K looks to me like a smart purchase! It is a 6 speed (a most-have for me), which will tend to depreciate at a lesser rate than the R-Tronic, especially now that the new S-Tronics have been announced for MY2014! The manual also has a greater appeal to the 'traditional' sport car enthusiasts in this market! Personally I like 'Lava Gray' - Audi does a fantastic job on all of their 'Pearl Effect' paints! It is a also relatively rare color since not many were ordered - so that is also a plus! I wish it would have had an 'Amulet Red' interior, but I can live with the 'Black & Alcantara'...unless I get lucky with my 'Parts Wanted Ad' in the classifieds! Even with a considerable discount of $20K+ on a left-over, new & unsold '12 Spyder (that it's doable on a Coupe & perhaps on Spyders too!), it couldn't match the savings I realized by letting the first buyer take the initial depreciation hit on this low mileage MY2011! The revised MY2014 US v8 models are expected to go up in price, yet the 'revisions' are minimal especially for the manual transmission buyer! Any price increase on the US '14 v8 Spyder will work to my advantage since the expected future depreciation for a well-kept, low mileage v8 Spyders will be less in relative terms! And this '11 Spyder, if any of you agree with me that it was bought well, does position me nicely - low acquisition cost & low mileage - for a future trade or sell private sale should I decide to order the next generation R8 (the new platform) expected out in 4 years or so! In any case, this purchase is what has brought me back to this forum! I am looking forward to making whatever contribution I can to the discussions here on R8Talk and running into old friends once again like Desperado!

Saludos,
Eduardo

[Lumberb]

Always enjoy your thorough posts Ed, good to see you over here. You'll love the v8r8. Get yourself a better exhaust (stasis) and call it a day. Has everything that the pcar spyder was missing and then some,( I had one too...)

[Dimitri]

Nice analysis

[NavySubOfficer]

Negotiation is an art. MB Annapolis originally listed your new ride for $129K, so you did well waiting them out to get it at $110K.

As another data point, I purchased the leftover Spyder at Princeton Audi based on best price ($126K). The next best deal I worked (no trade-in) was at Cherry Hill Imports at $128K on the identical car. Byers Imports wasn't as willing to negotiate and stayed in the mid $130's (also identical car), effectively taking themselves out of the race. The silver one at Momentum was negotiated down to $125K, but didn't have as many options and would have cost me more in the long run with shipping.

[desperado]

Hi Ed. Thank you for sharing your research and thoughts with the group, and I'm pleased that my enthusiasm contributed in some small way to your eventual decision!
I corrected the date in the subject line of the thread per your request.

[mark_nimda]

Negotiation is an art. MB Annapolis originally listed your new ride for $129K, so you did well waiting them out to get it at $110K.

As another data point, I purchased the leftover Spyder at Princeton Audi based on best price ($126K). The next best deal I worked (no trade-in) was at Cherry Hill Imports at $128K on the identical car. Byers Imports wasn't as willing to negotiate and stayed in the mid $130's (also identical car), effectively taking themselves out of the race. The silver one at Momentum was negotiated down to $125K, but didn't have as many options and would have cost me more in the long run with shipping.

Sometimes its not even an art. For the past 10 years or so, whenever I have wanted to purchase new, I have been sending mass emails to dealers, typically in the SE region of the U.S. although I have been known to travel as far as Texas. One thing I have discovered is often times supply and demand is geographically based and I think its a mistake for the ones who simply have not thought about traveling to pick up an order. Typically, an Invoice price can be had on Leftovers but you can even sometimes order at Invoice.

In my entire state of FL, noone would order me a 2013 A8 for invoice except 2 dealers, both of them in NW Florida (approx 360 miles away from me). I probably sent 30 emails to AUDI dealers. Some ignored me, some were initially interested but eventually said they couldnt do invoice and others said NFW would I land a 2013 A8 for invoice (which I expected to hear from most) Obviously you have to look at the OTD costs on the pre-order but my point everything is negotiable somewhere in the country if you are willing to travel, even on on a new order. AoA also gave me the $3K Loyalty discount on top pf my Invoice price.

I have had the same success on a 2011 S4, a 2007 Lexus LS460 and a 2004 S450 MERC (which was a disaster!). None of these cars were Lot cars, all pre-ordered at Invoice with an OTD price fully spelled out on a buyers order

On pre-owns with low mileage you have even a bigger advantage (if you arent picky on options) because dealers look at Black Book values (aka Auction price value) for trades. Find the blackbook on a pre-owned and you truly know what the dealer can play with on price.

You actually have much more leverage on an R8 pre-owned. The only issue there is if you are willing to travel even for a pre-owned, you may encounter some body work when you get there. I believe a CPO car cannot have body work but I am not sure. CPO would raise the costs a bit as well

Be willing to travel and have some patience and you would be shocked at what kind of price you could get on any model car. I have seen some amazing deals had on exotics.

Tks to the OP for sharing his info BTW

[desperado]

AoA also gave me the $3K Loyalty discount on top pf my Invoice price.

You can also obtain an additional $500 discount if you are an ACNA (Audi Club of North America) member. You do have to be a member for at least six months prior to the purchase date.

$500 Member Loyalty Bonus

Audi of America will reward ACNA members' loyalty to the Audi brand by providing a $500 cash incentive to members who purchase or lease a new or Certified Pre-owned Audi. (Currently available to U.S. residents only)

Additional ACNA discounts: http://www.audiclubna.org/audi-resou...acna-discounts.

Membership is a great investment!

[desperado]

I received this today from ACNA regarding upcoming changes to the Loyalty program:

New Loyalty Benefit for ACNA Members !

Dear Audi Club Members,

Your membership with Audi Club North America has special privileges including discounts on insurance, hotels, service/parts, Audi Collection merchandise, Audi Sportscar Driving experience, Brooks Brothers Clothing and more.

One of the premier benefits is the Loyalty program which rewards members on the purchase or lease of Audi automobiles. As a joint effort with Audi of America to accelerate the creation of Audi Fans, we are in the process of creating a new loyalty program for members as of February, 2013. Details will be announced soon.

Members who purchased or leased vehicles up to January 31, 2013 will still be able to request the loyalty bonus as applied in 2012. If you purchased/leased a car in January 2013, please download and submit all completed forms by February 20, 2013 to receive the loyalty claim. For questions, please call our office at 262-567-5476 or email admin@audiclubna.org.

Thank you and watch the website for the new loyalty program details! www.audiclubna.org

[BlueOne]

That's very thorough analysis Eduardo thanks for sharing. You have me thinking about the advantages that might be enjoyed w a Spyder.

[mark_nimda]

You can also obtain an additional $500 discount if you are an ACNA (Audi Club of North America) member. You do have to be a member for at least six months prior to the purchase date.



Additional ACNA discounts: http://www.audiclubna.org/audi-resou...acna-discounts.

Membership is a great investment!

They really need to fix their website. Their contacts all result in broken links. One thing that's annoying is a website with poor maintainance