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Manual or R-tronic?

25K views 41 replies 28 participants last post by  pompeyreece 
#1 ·
Just about to start my search for an early R8 V8. What is everyone's preferred transmission? Any pros and cons versus each other? I'll try and test drive both but as they are far and few between I might struggle. My RS6 is obviously an auto, is the R8 transmission on par with this?
Thanks. Lee
 
#2 ·
Technically the R tronic is semi automatic so not as slick as the dual clutch S tronic.

To save you some time, just go and try them both yourself - it really is personal choice.
 
#3 ·
What year RS6? If it's the older 2003 model, you can't even begin to compare. The old RS6's trans was archaically slow - pull shift lever, take a drink, wait for a minute, ah there's the shift into the next gear...

There are many threads about the virtues and downfalls of both transmissions. I've had both and prefer the R-tronic after learning how to use it correctly.
 
#4 ·
Do you want to change gear manually all the time ? If not then you go with R-Tronic. You won't really mind it at all once you understand it. Test them both if unsure, but understand the lift off the technique 1st. My wife can drive mine and also I live in the City with mixed traffic, so had to be R-Tronic for me, i don't think I'd buy manual with hindsight still. It shifts faster than manuals when in manual mode too.
 
#5 ·
Driving the R-tronic is very much like driving a manual, with the exception of using a clutch pedal. Some do enjoy driving a true manual more, but in my opinion, a possible advantage to having a manual MAY be a premium at resale.

I have owned several manuals, including my first Ferrari. My current Ferrari and R8 both have the automated manual, and they are a blast to drive. The main problem I have with the R-tronic is that the shift levers are mounted on the steering wheel and turn with the wheel, rather than being mounted on the steering column.
 
#6 ·
I came close to buying an R Tronic car in September, though I never actually drove the R8 as it was out of state. I absorbed every thread and every link I could on the transmission to try and get a feel for what I was in for. I came away with the impression there was no middle ground. The R Tronic was the transmission you either loved or hated. There wasn't even a consensus on whether the factory flash update helped.

I bought a 6MT and I'd have to rate it one of the more enjoyable manuals I've owned, and I've owned a ton of them. I found the gated shift clicks a bit annoying at first, but you get used to it.
 
#7 ·
It's really this simple - drive both and decide.

There's no shortage of opinions (countless threads on this subject), but the only opinion that will matter is yours.
 
#10 ·
I would (and did) get the R-tronic. I've driven the manual, R-tronic, and an R-tronic that had the "upgraded" flash. I just prefer to have the option of NOT having to manually shift all the time. R-tronic feels fine to me, and I can paddle shift if I want. Also, I think the R-tronic was an $8000 option, so if there's no premium being charged in a used car, R-tronic is a better value.
 
#12 ·
R-Tronic over manual.

Most that complain about the R-Tronic has not spent time driving it, or learned to. Despite the sexy look of the gated 6 speed, It got old quick. Not to mention you worry about any previous owner NOT knowing how to drive a manual properly, more clutch wear, or gears grinded... No thanks.
 
#13 · (Edited)
It is exactly the opposite....no problems on manuals and very easy to check if worn or not. Who got a manual new wanted an manual, on this level of new price option cost not really matters.
R-tronic on the other side you find tons of probs on forums as previous owner don't know how to use it properly and several workshops screw up the adjustment or alignment.

If you love manuals then the gated 6-speed is the holy grail and you should get it. This will never feel old as it is just classy and how you get a perfect connection to the car.
If you need to think about then you are not a manual guy and get the rtronic.

Have an rtronic because I got such a good deal on a 2008 which was standing nearly 4 years in the showroom of the dealer and then pampered by an rolce Royce collector for 25000km in 4 years only in summer. Wanted a manual but a deal like this is rare/ condition of R8 like new, so I bite the bullet and got it as it is my new daily driver. Can life with it but only after a TCU remap and new alignment by a shop who really know how to do it properly. Still miss the click though...as I am a manual guy.
Always driving rtronic in manual sport mode. Yes u are faster after TCU mod with it on mountain roads so definitely not a wrong buy.
 
#16 ·
May come down to how you are going to use the car. If it's a weekend warrior, the manual would be a blast. If it's a daily driver that will have you sitting in traffic, the manual could get old pretty quick.

I was on the fence as well and couldn't find local examples to drive. I had a M3 SMG so was familiar with how that style transmission felt. I have also owned a couple PDK equipped porsche cars and had a couple manual P-cars in the past as well. Went with R-tronic because:

a. Wife occasionally drives my car. She "can" drive a manual, but I wouldn't let her anywhere near a R8 manual transmission
b. I daily drive my car - I don't sit in a ton of traffic, but realistically the idea of having to operate a clutch to and from work didn't sound too appealing
c. Found a 2008 V8 R-tronic with 8k miles on it. Couldn't say now to such a unicorn.

If you are familiar with dual clutch cars like Porsche's PDK, the R-tronic is a good deal different. You need to drive it like a manual. You hammer the accelerator, the RPMs climb, you pull a paddle and you can feel/sense the clutch engage, as this is happening you feather off the accelerator as the system selects the new gear, then back onto the accelerator as the new gear engages. It's not like a PDK where you just mash the accelerator and bang, bang, bang through the gears. You really need to drive it like a manual only the car is engaging the clutch pedal for you. Takes a couple days to get used to, but once you get the hang of it, it's quite fun.

There's definitely something pure and raw about the manual, but the R-tronic give you a good mix of fun and practicality.

If you can find local cars where the dealer will actually let you test them, definitely give both a shot.
 
#17 ·
The "which is the best gearbox" can be a delicate subject and when I had an E46 M3 that question (SMG vs manual) caused a lot of heated debates online. I had an SMG which I loved, really liked using the paddles and as others have said about R-Tronic, you have to learn how to use it to a degree. I thought it added a sense of occasion and as trivial as it sounds the SMG gear stick set up looked much better than the manual gear stick in that M3, and it just felt more upmarket and more 'supercar'. Unfortunately I had to get the SMG replaced in the M3 and because of that I'd always choose a manual as there's less tech involved and so one less thing for me to worry about, plus on the R8 the open gate gearbox – to my eyes – looks fantastic. On the flip side, my girlfriend has asked why the gearbox is so noisy – she doesn't appreciate the sound of metal on metal as you go through the gears! :-D

As others have said, try both if you can or simply buy the best example you can regardless of gearbox, as there are plenty of fans for either option.
 
#19 ·
As you can see the opinions here are exactly opposite of each other. So drive an Rtronic. Not just around the block but for 20+ minutes around town. You should be getting the hang of it by the end of the drive. If you've driven a manual you will intuitively lift your right foot as the rtronic shifts and you'll have perfect, snappy shifts.

I never drive it in auto. 75% of the time I'm in sport, manual and it's a wonderful, visceral experience.

I wouldn't recommend you purchase the car based on resale value if you don't personally value the transmission. Are you buying the car for you or for the next owner?

Some here say the manual will have a premium and so your choices may have that premium already built in. Overall the market may slide either way during your ownership and if you paid for for a future spectulated premium and it's not there at then end of your ownership you may be disappointed.

Personally i love my rtronic now. It's stock by the way. No flash.
 
#20 ·
I spoke to service associates at three separate Audi dealers and none of them could recall a single R Tronic being brought in with issues. It's a durable transmission and the clutch should outlast the clutch from a manual transmission because it's automated and therefore doesn't make mistakes going through the gears.

That said, I have no regrets getting the 6MT. The shifts are smooth and precise and I'm in total control.
 
#41 ·
I'm in the same situation as OP looking for an early gen V8 R8 and seeing as it will be my DD, this comment above is what I was most concerned about. I have had my share of cars with both manual and paddles, and am starting to lean more towards the R-Tronic simply based on reliability. I have heard that R-Tronic is on par with BMW's SMG and S-Tronic is on par with BMW's DCT. But, for those of you that know SMG, know its flaws and when it goes it GOES lol.
 
#22 ·
Lots of opinions to this provocative topic......here's my .02 added to another thread from this forum.

Re: Manual R8s future classics?

I recently came across this response to a question posed to the owner of HEXAGON CLASSICS in England. His name is Paul Michaels and any time I read a response from someone who's "in the business" I give it more credence for obvious reasons. As I've stated before when it comes to the R8 only time will tell but I like this man's thinking. The article came from one of my all time favorite web-sites....PETROLICIOUS!

Here's Mr. Michaels reply to the question highlighted:

What do you think is the next car to go?

It’s all about numbers. If you want a hint, I think manual cars. When automatics became the rule of the day, I’m guessing here but, you can probably assume 70-80% of those cars are either automatic or SMG. So there’s a tiny number of manual cars, and as time goes by and people want to change gear on the weekend. I think this is particularly the case for the Porsche and Ferrari lines, where you’ll be seeing stick shift cars leading the way.
 
#23 ·
6MTs are nice, but take a while to locate and dont have the value of the R Tronics when you consider higher MSRP but a huge discount now versus the 6MT.. so you sort of save money not buying a new R tronic, and then save a chunk compared to the manual surcharge due to desirability.

I am a value guy, buy yes down the road the 6MT will be king. Who knows if we will all convert our cars at some point hehe
 
#24 · (Edited)
I look at this from two perspectives. What were the options available and how have the markets spoken with regards to pricing.

Options available:

When you look at two pedal solutions in premium sports cars, most of the automated single clutch implementations like R-tronic/E-gear/SMG/F1 have been almost entirely phased out. However, there is no replacement or major update for a three pedal manual transmission.

This in my opinion is a key element in the manual vs r-tronic discussion.
People seeking the best two pedal experience will mostly gravitate towards dual clutch transmissions (or whatever the latest/greatest option is).
People seeking the three pedal manual experience will simply opt for the manual. For these people you can't go "wrong" picking a manual in the sense that there is no other 3-pedal implementation. And the R8 has such a glorious/classic gated shifter at that.

And the R8 was unique in that the Gen1 actually came in all three flavors!


Money talks:

The markets have largely spoken and granted a premium to 3-pedal sports cars from the era where choices were 3-pedal manual vs automated single clutch. Just look at used F430, 360, R8 (Gen1 pre-face lift), Gallardo, Murcielago, M3, M5, etc. This is all the more notable given that the automated single clutch was typically a pricey option tacked onto MSRP.

The R-tronic isn't a bad transmission. In fact, it represents quite the bargain right now given the inventory vs pricing situation. It's just not a winner in my books from a pure attributes perspective.
 
#25 ·
This is obviously a personal, opinionated topic. If you want numbers to speak for themselves, buyers generally want automated transmissions, which is WHY the manual has gone away. Sure, there are die-hard fans of manual, but that's not general preference.

The buyer should buy because of his/her own preference, not because of some theoretical extra resale value down the road. That's not why we buy these cars.
 
#26 ·
Bingo.

The numbers don't lie. Many people think that manufacturers are just trying to stick it to the manual die-hards, but the truth is, when offered in their vehicles, fewer and fewer are being spec'd that way. Why? Well, various reasons. But among them:

- New generations don't have the same love affair (in large part, not everyone of course) with manuals. Many, even car enthusiasts, don't even know how to drive a manual.

- Many people just want the "fastest" when buying a sports/supercar. If the acceleration numbers for the manual are less appealing, the arm-chair racers often go for the one that's quicker - the automated.

- Expectations, from ease of use through reliability, are being pushed for supercars. What was once acceptable in the 80's (obscure, difficult to drive, lacking creature comforts, contortionist skills to get in/out, etc) is no longer acceptable to buyers today. So, supercars are becoming just very fast, capable performance versions of products that would otherwise look like luxury sedans on paper - including all of the creature comforts, amenities, and daily drive-ability (hence a trend towards DD friendly transmissions that can pull double duty on a race-track).

But this does cause an interesting dilemma in the second-hand market. There are many more buyers in the second hand market than primary, since depreciation opens up the possibility of purchase to those who couldn't (or wouldn't) otherwise purchase new. There may be a greater proportion of manual buyers in the second-hand market than the primary (again, various reasons here), and that causes a bit of a drought on manual car availability. But over time, and maybe not that far off (a decade or two), I suspect even this will subside. Manuals are, for better or worse, dying out in favor of new technology that does it better and faster... not yet cheaper, but soon enough.

But hey... all said... R-Tronic or Manual? Neither... S-Tronic! :) It's the fastest, the friendliest to use, and has the most Jekyll and Hyde abilities for everything from DD in town to race-track. Sorry, couldn't let all of you R-Tronic and manual guys duke it out without S-Tronic representation! :)

But in all seriousness, as cooljellow states here... it's all buyer preference. Buy what you're going to enjoy driving every time you get behind the wheel... that's the only real consideration.
 
#27 ·
The unique situation of the Gen1 R8 though is that it was offered in all 3 transmissions across its lifespan: manual, R-tronic, and S-tronic. As a result R-tronic will always live in the shadows of the S-tronic.
People seeking the fastest/most comfortable solution typically will go for the S-tronic. Manual junkies will go for the manual.
Sorry if my previous post was roundabout.
 
#28 ·
racerx makes a good point. the issue is numbers. there's going to be fewer stronics and manuals than rtronics. I think of the rtronic as in the middle of the other 2. more visceral than the stronic with it's less refined shifts (at least when you don't know how to shift it) but more convenient than a manual.

i don't think you can go wrong with either of them. I initially wanted a manual, i'm a die hard manual guy. However my last car was a 2013 911 pdk. and i was determined to go back to a manual. then this special edition popped up, it's not like i had a choice. It was take it or leave it. I'm very happy with the rtronic as i manually shift it, using the stick 100% of the time. i know it has paddle shifters but the sensation of shifting is had with the stick. just pushing forward and pulling backwards is cool. shifts are faster than any manual. Its very satisfying.
 
#29 ·
The auto vs manual debate comes down to preference but there's another factor I don't see highlighted often...age of driver.

From personal observation of a lot of car club members, the more mature members tend to favor the manuals while the younger drivers lean towards the fastest and latest auto gearboxes.

So is it an age thing that is driving the manual gearbox preference? I'm not sure but I'm beginning to hear more of them complaining their knees hurt after a long cross country drive lately. :p

Back to the OP question, as many wise and experience R8 owners are saying here, drive both and then see which you prefer. Cheers.
 
#31 ·
Manual no question..... gated shifter is bliss.
 
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