Audi R8 Forums banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
What is Audi recommended oil type for 2021 R8 ?

My dealer wants to put 0W30, but I also read here on the forum people run Castrol Supercar oil, which is 10W60.

My (European) manual says nothing about the engine oil weight, apart from the fact that you can top up with VW504 / 508 / 511 or ACEA C3 oil.

508 00 oils require ... a 0W20 (!) viscosity.

To add to the confusion, US manual (2020 Audi R8 Coupe – Owner's Manual – Page #235 – PDF) advises to top up with ACEA C3 or API SN oils and nothing about VW504 / 508 / 511 oils.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,738 Posts
Use a VW504 & ACEA C3 oil, all of the former will be either 0W30 or 5W30. I don't know anyone running a 10W60 in a gen2. You can also a VW502 oil but these are not approved for long life service and not generally used by dealers in the UK. VW504 is a higher standard.

Did you check the sticker on the engine compartment lid referred to in the owner's manual?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,347 Posts
As Steve has said, any oil that meets the specifications will be fine. IIRC, Castrol Edge is one example.
 

·
Registered
2020 performance coupe
Joined
·
90 Posts
Use a VW504 & ACEA C3 oil, all of the former will be either 0W30 or 5W30. I don't know anyone running a 10W60 in a gen2. You can also a VW502 oil but these are not approved for long life service and not generally used by dealers in the UK. VW504 is a higher standard.

Did you check the sticker on the engine compartment lid referred to in the owner's manual?
the biggest standard for VW 504’s seems driven by EU emissions and required detergent mix NOT engine protection as #1……the Castrol Supercar is likely, THE best oil you can use , reccommended for NA cars and I come from years of 0-40 Mobil One Euro car formula…..OEM for Porsche GT Car Motors
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
The problem with Castrol Supercar motor oil is that my dealer will not put it in when the car is still under warranty - it does not meet VW 504 spec.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,738 Posts
I have not heard of any R8 suffering from excessive engine wear or premature failure due to running the recommended VW504 0/5W30 oil. The VW504 wear test is one of the most onerous in the car industry which is one of the reasons some smaller oil blenders cannot afford the approval. But you could run a racing oil that will have superior wear protection at the expense of dispersants and detergents which extend the life of the oil. I have no doubt Castrol Supercar 10W60 is a good oil but have not seen any evidence that it is better for a V10 engine than the recommended oil for normal use. Moreover, some owners on here have reported high oil temperatures on the track using 10W60. Note that Castrol have also jumped on the efficiency bandwagon and produce an Edge Supercar 0W20.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,738 Posts
The problem with Castrol Supercar motor oil is that my dealer will not put it in when the car is still under warranty - it does not meet VW 504 spec.
Your car has a gas particulate filter so needs an ACEA Cx oil. Your dealer is correct in not using Castrol Supercar which is a full saps oil. Dealers in the US may have a different view as the R8s there do not have a GPF.
 

·
Registered
2020 performance coupe
Joined
·
90 Posts
I have not heard of any R8 suffering from excessive engine wear or premature failure due to running the recommended VW504 0/5W30 oil. The VW504 wear test is one of the most onerous in the car industry which is one of the reasons some smaller oil blenders cannot afford the approval. But you could run a racing oil that will have superior wear protection at the expense of dispersants and detergents which extend the life of the oil. I have no doubt Castrol Supercar 10W60 is a good oil but have not seen any evidence that it is better for a V10 engine than the recommended oil for normal use. Moreover, some owners on here have reported high oil temperatures on the track using 10W60. Note that Castrol have also jumped on the efficiency bandwagon and produce an Edge Supercar 0W20.
Like I said, the difference is because of EU emissions. Petroleum engineers have done reviews on this, the Castrol is better, this is why, without the bullshit EU requirements, all North American cars are sticker'd for the Castrol.
EU cares ZERO for internal combustion protection, UK is probably worst of all.
ME...I'd find a shop to put in best oil for the job, keep receipts, warranty is fully covered.
 

·
Registered
2020 performance coupe
Joined
·
90 Posts
Out of curiosity, you might be interested that the R8 LMS cars owners manual is available online.
Guess what the recommended oil is for those ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
My dealer said no to 5W30 oil (VW 504 / 507).

Anyone tried Ravenol VSW 0W-30 ?

It seems this is one of the few fully syntethic oil available in 0W30 grade with VW 504 / 507 approval.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,738 Posts
Never tried it as it's too expensive here in UK. It will be a good oil - PAO based which is why it costs more. Shell also make a VW504 0W30 Helix Ultra AV-L
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The problem with Shell Helix Ultra Professional AV-L 0W-30 oil is that it is not a full synthetic oil (PAO based like Ravenol) - it is a hydrocarack oil.

Most oils sold as "full sythetic" oils are in fact hydrocrack oils, not true full sythetic. On most of the markets there is no oil advertising regulations, so the manufacturers call their oils however they see fit for marketing reasons. This is how their hydrocrack oils became "fully sythetic".

The only coutry I'm aware of that does have strick oil marketing regulations in place is Germany - which is why I always check if the oil is a true sythetic on german websites !

If it says HC or "Synthese Tehnologie" - it is not a fully sythetic oil.

This is a German bottle (where they have to fully disclose it is not a fully synthetic oil):




Now compare the very same oil sold on other markets, with the "Fully Synthetic" BS:



Anyway, I went ahead and bought that Ravenol VSW 0W-30 oil.

It was 2.5x the price of Mobil and Castrol offerings, but it is a true, PAO based, fully synthetic oil.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,738 Posts
Well I'm glad you got it sorted out. Ravenol have some great products but I just can't justify the cost though I would NOT be critical of anyone using it - it may be double the cost of other oils but it's still a very small premium in the overall cost of R8 ownership which for me has been dominated by depreciation. Having said that, I'm happy enough with the products I use - always VW approved oils and typically awarded to the lowest bidder! I've had some used oil analysis done, for what it's worth, and nothing noteworthy.

I don't agree that the Shell "fully synthetic" is BS. The base oil is made from the gas to liquids technology and starts out as methane. Similarly PAO base oil which is synthesized from ethylene also starts off as a hydrocracked crude product. In my opinion the Shell base oil is just as synthetic as PAO, although could not be labelled as such in Germany due to the court ruling in Düsseldorf, 2008.

The final German court ruling (against Motul) had nothing to do with chemistry or synthesis per se - the plaintiff argued that the German public associated "vollsynthetisches" = fully synthetic with PAO Group IV base oils regardless of the synthesis of the HC Group III oils. The Regional Court of Cologne disagreed with the plaintiff, agreed with Motul and instructed the plaintiff to pay for the costs. On appeal, the Higher Court in Düsseldorf agreed with the plaintiff and ordered Motul not to brand their products as "vollsynthetisches" and to pay for the costs. A French company in a German court defending their interpretation of a German descriptor was probably only ever going to end one way! If I recall correctly, Motul appealed and lost.

There was a similar complaint back in 1999 in the USA by Mobil against Castrol for using the term fully synthetic for its Group III based engine oils, although this was not a lawsuit and often misreported as such. In this case, The National Advertising Division (NAD) agreed with Castrol that a Group III hydroisomerized base oil was sufficiently different from the feed product that it could be labelled synthetic. It probably didn't help Mobil's case that they too were marketing hydroisomerized base oils in Europe as synthetic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thanks for the insight.

Shell oil, made from gas to liquids technology, is indeed a bit different. However, the problem remains that most of the "Fully Synthetic" oils on the market are in fact Group III oils, which means they are hydrocraked mineral oils, not synthetic ones. It is a bit like painting stripes on a horse and calling it a zebra.

Base Oil Groups Explained:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
49 Posts
Determine your use and choose applicable to spec.

Ex. If you want a set it and forget it oil that will handle a variety of temperatures, 0W30 is fine.
Ex2. If you track the car (not applicable for spirited street driving) and your oil operates at temps a bit higher than average then I'd use a 15w50 or 10w60 (whichever meets spec)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
The car is still under warranty, so I have to stick to 0W30 / VW 504. I do not track the car.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top