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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Second post on this, so ill link to the first below with the details. But the questions is this.

If an Audi spark plug (made by NGK) fails, and causes internal engine damage and requires a new engine. Who pays for that? Does anyone think Audi could be pushed far enough to take responsibility for the failed part and cough up a new engine? My car is a 2014 Gated V-8, and just turned 40k. Prior to the new plugs, less than 200 miles ago, the car was mechanically perfect. Thoughts? Spark plug pic below. The exploded one is obvious and the one next to it, was the cylinder next to it that was subsequently misfiring.

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I'd ask then nicely and see what they say. Then pay your lawyer a few hundred bucks to ask with a threat. I've found that the lawyer letters at least get the attention and sometimes help. Never done it on a car issue though. Typically just in business when I have a legitimate issue. This is business ti the audi dealer.
 

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Begs the question... who installed it? Could raise additional question/doubt.
It would be Audi who have to prove that it was fitted incorrectly. It's an OEM part so they cant wiggle out saying its aftermarket and not oem. If you bought the parts from Audi then it should be an easy case.
 
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It would be Audi who have to prove that it was fitted incorrectly. It's an OEM part so they cant wiggle out saying its aftermarket and not oem. If you bought the parts from Audi then it should be an easy case.
Agreed.

Tell them you installed/torqued to spec per erwin using calibrated tools. Spark plug changes are not complicated so they're going to have a hard time dying on the hill that it was a bad installation. I don't doubt that they'll first claim that it was because of installation.

Also, can you provide a clearer picture? I have a specialization in forensic engineering which mostly includes steel/alloys. The picture is a little blurry but it looks like material failure at the threads which is 100000000000000% not your fault.
 

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It would be Audi who have to prove that it was fitted incorrectly. It's an OEM part so they cant wiggle out saying its aftermarket and not oem. If you bought the parts from Audi then it should be an easy case.
Would be very difficult to prove plug fault. Many install issues can be cause of failure… over torque cracked insulator, cross thread, no gap, too big gap, dropped and cracked, etc.

Uphill battle for sure.
 

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For what it's worth, and I posted this in the OP's other thread, my engine failure was diagnosed by Audi, and the spark plug failure was identified as the root cause. Originally they believed it was the valve that failed, but they later revised the diagnosis to the plug with the valve as collateral damage. The plug was original (NGK) and in place from delivery day from the factory. The engine had ~16k miles on it and was 3.5 years old when it happened.

Not only did Audi diagnose the plug as the root cause, my SA went so far as to "frame" it and give it to me as a token to remember the ordeal. See pic below.

Now, I have no idea if they're right or wrong in that diagnosis (they apparently believe it was correct - and the engine went back to Germany for a full post mortem), and I also have no idea what happened with the OP's engine... but I will say it's a bit coincidental looking, minimally, just seeing his pic against mine. As a major caveat, though, I have no credentials or mechanical inclination to form any firm opinions here!

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
In addition the tech has seen this before, actually someone on this forum who just by chance lives close to be, will go on record stating it. And as you said, it would be difficult to prove it wasn’t the faulty plug.
I'm reading this thinking it's time to swap out my NGK's for some Bosch.
I will def switch to Bosch whenever this gets resolved.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hi

How do you know that the spark plug is the cause of the damage?

Tom
The plugs were changed less than 100 miles ago and is a reoccurring issue. (as reoccurring as it could be considering low production numbers). There has been no other changes in vehicle, driving conditions etc, except the plug. These engines rarely just fail. There’s is always a reason, and everything points to this spark plug.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Would be very difficult to prove plug fault. Many install issues can be cause of failure… over torque cracked insulator, cross thread, no gap, too big gap, dropped and cracked, etc.

Uphill battle for sure.
I understand. However the installation malfunction would be visible. The other 7 plugs, being properly torqued, the insulator being perfectly in tact. Crush washer is properly crushed etc. I think it’s harder to prove it wasn’t the plug, rather than prove it was the plug. The absence of another clear reason, process of elimination can hold as a diagnosis.
 

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Hi

So the V8s die without warning and countless V8 engines have detonated in the past.
The spark plug shown in the picture is destroyed and cannot be considered as the cause.
The spark plug ignites the mixture and if the plug fails, the driver notices that a cylinder is missing because the engine is running strangely.
At full load only massive ringing can damage the engine and if that is the case on one cylinder then there is a different problem.
If an injector delivers too little fuel, that would be one reason for the cylinder to get too hot and jam.

Tom
 

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Hi

So the V8s die without warning and countless V8 engines have detonated in the past.
The spark plug shown in the picture is destroyed and cannot be considered as the cause.
The spark plug ignites the mixture and if the plug fails, the driver notices that a cylinder is missing because the engine is running strangely.
At full load only massive ringing can damage the engine and if that is the case on one cylinder then there is a different problem.
If an injector delivers too little fuel, that would be one reason for the cylinder to get too hot and jam.

Tom
is such a catastrophic engine failure normal for the v8s?!
 

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Just my two cents as someone who had a catastrophic V10 engine failure (maybe rod bearing - will never know), what covered me was always having service at Audi and meticulous records. While service at an indy or even at home could be 1000x better than at my/most dealers, it really made it hard for Audi to argue against themselves. I think it might be a bit of an uphill battle for you since you replaced them yourself. They could always argue you didn't install them properly, correct torque, etc. I wish you the best of luck and hope something works out in your favor! Keep us posted.
 
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